DN632804847

Subject: itcl in the core (WAS: Tcl/Tk 8.4a1 release) - DN [1]

Jeffrey Hobbs <jeff_hobbs@my-deja.com> - 08 Jun 2000 - comp.lang.tcl

 In article <8hosqq$5cl$1@bob.news.rcn.net>,
   dgp@cam.nist.gov wrote:
 > "George A. Howlett" wrote:
 > >>>> I'm hoping it's good news and [incr Tcl] will be distributed with
 8.4.
 >
 > Jeffrey Hobbs <jeffrey.hobbs@ajubasolutions.com> wrote:
 > >>> Actually George we're still just waiting on you to give us a patch
 > >>> making all the necessary changes to put itcl into the core as a
 > >>> package.
 >
 > George A. Howlett <gah@cadence.com> wrote:
 > >> I ask Ajuba Solutions a serious question and this is the response?
 >
 > Jeffrey Hobbs <hobbs@lorax.scriptics.com> wrote:
 > > What about that answer isn't serious?
 >
 > Uhh, Jeff, the smiley at the end of your message was a pretty good
 > indicator you intended a joking tone.  Don't change your mind after
 > the fact.

 It may have been somewhat facetious, but that doesn't mean I'm
 not always quite serious about the need for more community support
 rather than community derision.

    ....
 > This is the first invitation I've seen from the core team to
 contribute
 > the changes necessary to package [incr Tcl] with the Tcl distribution.
 > Why attribute to community laziness what can be explained by a lack of
 > direction / invitation from the core team?

 Why does the community always need an explicit invitation?  They
 are very clear about what they want - but mostly very sparse in
 providing help to achieve that task.  Which gets on to the next
 point...

 > Nobody wants to be left holding the bag.  The last "official" word on
 > [incr Tcl] in the Tcl distribution was "We are considering it".  It

 Actually, no, as was pointed out by others already.  The core
 team has moved beyond that point and is looking at the finer
 issues of exactly how one would add a full cross-platform
 package to the core distribution.  It's a little hard to follow,
 because the discussions jump between here and the itcl mailing
 list, and in some cases private email.  No, I don't expect people
 to know what's in my inbox, but that's also why I always encourage
 people to use the available public channels.

 > so yes, we are too "lazy" to go to the effort to produce the patch
 > unless we're fairly sure it's actually going to be accepted.
 >
 > Ask and ye shall receive.

 On your mark, get set, go.  We need a clean solution to including
 cross-platform C-based pacakages in the core distribution.  This
 would first be used on itcl, so is the best example.  tcllib is
 another new package to go in the core distro, but this is still
 Tcl-only at the moment (although it seems like many would like to
 see this include C stuff).

 As for some being too "lazy", I'd like to thank people like Jan
 Nijtmans, Matt Newman, Peter Spjuth, Michael McLennan, Andreas
 Kupries, Mark Diekhans, Karl Lehenbauer and the list goes on,
 who had the fortitude to stick with maintaining core patches
 over numerous versions until the "core team" (which has changed
 quite a bit over time) was able to get the bandwidth to include
 their very useful work.

 Remember that when something goes into the core, it ideal has
 full tests and docs as well before it makes a release.  This is
 a lot of work, and the more help that the core team gets in this
 task the better the overall product is (Tcl/Tk).

 I must admit that I've been remiss in my intentions to have a
 full disclosure of the roadmap going forward, but I haven't even
 had the time for that amongst all the fixing.  I'll try and get
 a rough draft of that up tonight, before I take off for Tcl'Europe.

 --
    Jeffrey Hobbs                     The Tcl Guy
    hobbs at ajubasolutions.com       Ajuba Solutions (née Scriptics)

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